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Showing posts with label Bane Thralls. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Bane Thralls. Show all posts

Sunday, October 2, 2011

Intervention: Bane Thralls & Tartarus

Intervene: To come between disputing people. This series of articles will attempt to present a realistic picture, of the model/units we generally accept, as slightly overpowered win buttons. I apologize in advance for the trite quotes.
Our scout's torch and lantern went black, and we heard him scream. A moment later a horrible chill washed over us. We could feel them before we could see them. - Tyrell Forlaine
Bane Thralls are the undisputed kings of problem solving, and simply putting the unit in your army ensures a fairly decent return on your investment. They're a unit with a very high offensive potential, and exceptional defensive abilities tossed in for good measure. They can engage and annihilate just about anything, ignore half the feats in the game, and presents your opponent with some really difficult choices. The Bane Thralls are amongst the best units in the game, and every time I take to the field without them, I end up regretting that decision, but they do have issues.

The first problem they face is a lack of Flow: The ability to ignore terrain, enemy models, and slowing effects. That means you can't charge across obstacles, will get stuck in terrain, and will die to free strikes. This can be solved by bringing Saxon Orrik, or using them with a caster that has access to one of the Flow spells or abilities, but this will add to the resource investment the unit requires.
Terrain is often of more value than bravery
- Flavius Vegetius
The second problem is: threat range. The Bane Thralls can really move it when Tartarus is around, but without him they become laughably slow. It's a well known problem, but even with Tartarus, the Bane Thralls are half an inch slower than a speed six reach model, and there are quite a few of those around. That in turn means, that when you face another melee army, your Bane Thralls might be lacking the range to engage. This is a huge problem, because receiving a charge really hurts, and Bane Thralls lack the reach to truly layer their way out of that problem.
He who is prudent and lies in wait for an enemy who is not, will be victorious.
- Sun Tzu
The ability to force you back half an inch every turn might not seem like much, but it's worth a lot more than you might think. He can move up ranged models and fire at will, which means you face a problem without obvious solutions. You can stay back and suffer his guns, or you can move up and receive a charge. There are several ways of getting around this (Darragh Wrathe, slowing/rooting feats, or having more guns than he does), but it's something to keep in mind when building a list. You really want to avoid being in a position where you're getting shot to pieces, and have to absorb a charge in order to advance.
Being shelled is the real work of an infantry soldier, which no one talks about. Everyone has his own way of going about it. In general, it means lying face down and contracting your body into a small a space as possible.
- Louis Simpson
The conclusion is that we need a lot of bodies (8 points), the Unit Attachment (3 points), Bane Lord Tartarus (4 points), Saxon/Skarlock (2 points), and Darragh Wrathe (4 points) in order to cover the issues. That's a rather large package, but I actually feel it's worth it. The models we include just need to serve multiple purposes, because twelve Bane Thralls rarely carry that amount of weight in a game, if they stick to hitting things.

Bane Thralls are walking debuffs, and it pays to remember that. A further ARM debuff is always welcome, and will turn other units from average to deadly, simply by running in, if they've got nothing better to do. I was also recently made aware, that when a model is knocked down it cannot be engaged, but since it's still in the melee range of nearby models, you can apply Dark Shroud without giving the model the added defense.

At this point I've done very little Bane Thrall bashing, and that's because very little is needed. There are a few things we need to keep in mind, but the second Bane Lord Tartarus leaves play, the unit becomes a whole different animal, so I'm going to bash Tartarus instead!
Linchpin: A central cohesive source of support and stability.
Bane Lord Tartarus is crucial to the success of the Bane Thralls, and if he dies your fast, accurate and deadly unit, turns into a slow and inaccurate unit, with some very real problems when it comes to applying their deadly blows where they count. This is actually a big problem, because Bane Lord Tartarus isn't that hard to kill (I've even had him die to boosted blast damage once), and taking him out is such a major blow to your pumped up unit of killers, that an opponent can dedicate a substantial amount of resources to do it.

Bane Lord Tartarus is a four point solo, with some beefed up defenses, but he will still die to a weapon master landing a hit. He will die if he engages, if something ignores stealth, or if you mess up his placement, and when he dies your Bane Thrall monster unit becomes a lot more manageable for an opponent. No more spawning Thralls, no more hitting solos on average dice, and no more useful threat ranges, so choosing when to sacrifice Tartarus is vital. I've seen Tartarus charge in and create three new Bane Thralls (heck I've done it myself), get killed, and suddenly the entire unit of Bane Thralls are stuck fighting Winterguard or Kayazy Assassins, without a realistic chance of ever hitting them.


The Bane Thralls are, without a doubt, amongst the best units in the game, but only while Tartarus roams the table. If you loose Tartarus, you not only loose a four point model, but also take a massive hit to your offensive power, since your main offensive melee unit just got nerfed badly. Keeping Tartarus safe, and knowing when to sacrifice him is what I consider the key, to squeezing that extra gallon of juice out of a superb unit.

Thursday, April 28, 2011

DM qualifier on May 28th...

It seems there's a fair chance of getting to play in the Danish Masters anyway, but I'd still like to be there because I actually qualified, and not because some random spots open up. With that in mind I'll be bringing my Dark Swarm list that did so well in the last tournament, but this is 50 points games so I can actually field it almost like it's supposed to.

Lich Lord Terminus
- Leviathan
- Leviathan
Bane Thralls (Maximum)
- Officer & Standard
Bane Thralls (Minimum)
Bile Thrall (Minimum)
The Withershadow Combine
Bane Lord Tartarus
Darragh Wrathe
Madelyn Corbeau

The list only has a single change from the original, which is the addition of the UA to the Bane Thrall unit, at the cost of a reduction of models in the other. The reason for this change is casters like pSorcha, who really messed up my advance when she froze my lines. This has the potential of taking me out of the game due to scenario loss, and that will not stand.

With the Officer & Standard they will unfreeze and stand up automatically, making my advance flow a lot easier. The list is still lacking infantry, but the only way to get more in is to remove a Leviathan. The second Leviathan is what makes the list work, so I'll have to make due. The final thing my list is lacking is Saxon Orrik, but the only Thing I can remove is Bane Lord Tartarus, and he's been so incredibly useful.

Now to get in some games with the list... I'm getting my second Leviathan & Bane Thralls come Monday, and the wings for my new Terminus arrived as well. Now I just need to find some time to assemble it all without going insane.
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Sunday, April 24, 2011

Dark Swarm, now with rested bonus!

I did my posting a bit late last night, so I think I missed a couple of things. I don't really remember details about the battles, but I do have a little more to offer on the Terminus Dark Swarm list. As I posted last night I was told in no unclear terms that I brought the wrong models for Terminus, but taking first and using only that army sort of proved him wrong. I did mess up and won the first two games by luck, but by the semi-finals and the final I had gotten to grips with using the Dark Swarm list.

The Dark Swarm list is more durable:
  • The Mechanithrall hordes outnumber the Dark Swarm list by more than two to one, but they lack any sort of defense. A Mechanithrall will be hit by most ranged units on sixes or better, and will die on anything but snake eyes. A Bane Thrall unit simply won't get hit by most ranged units at all, and if they face a unit that ignores stealth they feature the same defense as Mechanithralls, and a lot more ARM.
  • A opponent with blasts will regularly place the blast where he needs it to be, and inflict a lot of destruction on the tightly packed ARM 12 Mechanithralls (POW6 kills them on average). Against Bane Thralls the blast will nearly always scatter, and even a POW8 blast which are really rare, will need to roll above average to kill a Bane. There are also fewer Bane Thralls on the table, so blasts will hit fewer models as well.
  • A Tough check on a Bane Thrall means a lot more than a similar check on a Mechanithrall. Whenever a Mechanithrall manages to live you get a Mechanithrall (woop woop!)... when a Bane Thrall lives you get a pissed of weapon master standing up in his face the following round (even better if that unit has the UA). That means that each Bane Thrall will continue soaking hits until he's dead for good, which can often save other Bane Thralls from a similar fate, as most opponent's will come for the guy with DEF 5 that is automatically hit in melee.
The Dark Swarm list hits harder:
  • A Bane Thrall on the charge swings for 27 damage on average, while a Mechanithrall swings for 25.5 with a combo strike, so how can the stealth list hit harder when there are twice as many Mechanithralls? The first thing you'll have to take into consideration is space: In any game featuring infantry hordes you'll muck up charge lanes, and even when you don't you'll be hard pressed to get more than four models charging a heavy on average (some games will let you get more, but we need to look at the big picture). This means that the numerical superiority of Mechanithrall horde means nothing for their force application in any given round, but the extra damage and MAT of the Bane Thralls will mean a lot. The Bane Thralls also bring Tartarus, which allows them to take on Cryx jacks and circle beasts at DEF 13+ and still hit somewhat reliably with MAT8, which is something that should never be underestimated.
  • The second thing we have to look at is free strikes: The Mechanithralls are PS 11, and while they hit at PS15 when doing combo strikes, that means nothing on free strikes. This means than a Khador Heavy will take a single point of damage on average per strike, and it honestly won't care... Bane Thralls on the other hand swing for full damage, and taking seven points on a heavy for every Bane Thrall means that the jack is staying where it is. In addition the Bane Thralls have increases ARM and Stealth, making it harder to remove those free strikes by shooting the Bane Thralls to free it up.
  • Minor things include offering Terminus a further -2 debuff against ARM, and while this is usually not vital it is very nice to have when facing hard focus campers 
The Dark Swarm list is more maneuverable:
  • Moving 18-22 models around is easier than moving 38 models around. It also takes a lot less time to do so, allowing for a bit more careful placing of models to avoid clogging up. In addition there's no shuffling around to allow Stitch Thralls to collect corpses, and placing Mechanithralls to prevent someone from shooting your precious Necrosurgeons.
  • Having only half the screen allows you to play your Bile Thralls more effectively, since they can now actually get through the screen in order to Purge, and you will lose less of your own screen that way. Now here's the first thing where the Mechanithrall horde has any real advantage, because losing your own Bane Thralls to a purge really hurts. In order to prevent this, I've been practicing setting up the lines to minimize my own casualties, and the one time I did this yesterday I only lost two Bane Thralls and gained eight souls for Terminus... Fair trade in my book.
 It still needs more playtesting, but I really feel this concept outperforms the Mechanithrall horde by miles, and so far the testing has been supporting that claim. The list has issue at 35 points and is unplayable below that, but as most tournaments are 35/50 points this should rarely be an issue in competitive play, and let's face it... if you're playing friendly games the list composition really doesn't matter anyway.

29-04.2011: I feel a slight update to this post is in order. The Dark Swarm has been found to benefit a lot from one Bane Thrall unit with the Officer & Standard. Originally I was fielding them without the UA, since Terminus grants them Tough anyway, but stationary or knocked down Bane Thralls really mess up the lanes, and the easy solution is to just field the UA. This unit is the one you place in front of Terminus, so come maintenance phase they'll shake whatever was affecting them, and be ready to move out of the way.
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